Yikes - I can’t believe that talk of a spouse being a ‘halver’ or a ‘doubler’ is still current. What a thing to burden spouses with - what a way to manipulate them.

Ah, Gordo, I live for the day when I find us in happy agreement. Perhaps we need a thread about creation ‘science’?

Well, we’ve actually had the discussion and Mrs J would not like it at all!

Does the marriage serve the ministry? Is the wife’s worth to be judged in this way? Does this talk merely encourage husbandly careerism? You wouldn’t want to be rated a halver, now, would you ladies - so you’d better not complain when your husband neglects you…

GC, we’ve seen that go painfully wrong far too many times.

Thanks Sandy for mentioning the wonderful example of BB Warfield.

Remember that Zac requests that his readers don’t just give up on the essence of what he is saying because you find his style abrasive (p7)!

And he’s aware this particular principle will upset some readers (p35).

This may be one case where I should have stated his error to avoid, which might have clarified what he meant by his provocative principle - namely marrying a person unsuited for the pressures of ministry.

He is primarily talking to those not yet married about being thoughtful if you intend to be in ministry about what sort of spouse would be suited. He is also talking about those whom might be especially subject to the pressures of ministry which can cause resentment.

But he also mentions those whose heart is just not in ministry at all, or whose own career takes priority over all else.

I still remain uncomfortable with the bluntness of Zac’s generalisation, and stand by what I said. However I hope the extra info might fill out a little his thinking.

It is certainly not aimed at making a wife feel guilty, for example, because she got sick.

<i>Perhaps we need a thread about creation ‘science’?</i>

That would be good, although I think I’ve changed my mind.

Let me first protect myself by noting that Fiona is more likely to dislike the doubling/having slogan than I have given her credit for.

But let me also introduce some Bible to the discussion, by arguing that the stereotyping of Proverbs 31 is true. That woman really knows what she is doing. We should be like her, or at least those of the female persuasion should give it a shot.

Those who feel guilty for not being like her shouldn’t feel guilty, but they should ask themselves what it would take to become like that (and this could include the miracle of God’s grace—let’s be honest here about how far away from the ideal each one of us is)

I would have thought that it’s helpful to be prompted think about whether our choices and actions benefit the gospel or work against it. That’s not to say that every action must fall into one of those categories and that there are no other possibilities or outcomes. Should the point be taken literally? No. Can it be a devise? Yes.

I reckon this is one of the most dubious parts of the book.  Extraordinarily unhelpful

I mean - seriously, should we divorce our wives because we reckon their halving our ministry?  It’s hardly the attitude to our wives that Paul encourages in Eph 5.

This type of thinking encourages us to view our wives as burdensome millstones around our necks, rather then gifts from God who we are called to love and serve. 

It encourages us to look enviously at other wives, wishing they were like Wife X.  Or to look at other men’s wives with contempt - “Thank God my wife isn’t like HER!”.

By all means - we should be thinking about how best to serve God, as husbands, wives and couples.  But lets do it by encouraging, serving, and loving our wives, not by setting them up in ugly competition to serve our own ends.

@Mike: Sandy’s abridged review will appear in the December issue of The Briefing, which we are working on now.

There will be another five blog posts up on Sola Panel in the next couple of weeks though!

It’s of courseing true that spouses impact on each other, including in the area of ministry.

But surely the most significant and direct impact is not on our effectiveness, but on our character.  “How will married life with this person make me more or less like Jesus?” is surely the question we want people to be reflecting on whether or not they are contemplating full-time ministry.

I haven’t read Zac’s piece but I doubt that he would be suggesting that you guys should divorce ‘uneffective’ wives. And hopefully we should all be concerned with encouraging our spouses, present and future, to love Jesus more and more and that should be our primary aim in marriage.

I do think it’s fair, though, for men considering paid ministry to also think about whether the woman they are thinking of marrying would want to go into ministry and could handle the demands that it will entail. To not do so would be unloving and unrealistic. As to how effective their shared ministry would be, our personal and marital godliness is our responsibility and the rest is up to God.

Hey Fiona—great to have you commenting on Sola Panel. I’m sure it is more than doubling Gordon’s commenting ministry.

Fiona is right in that Zac is speaking to young ministers in how to choose a marriage partner.

However, even in this situation, I just don’t think it’s helpful.  It dangerously distorts the relationship between a husband and a wife, and the relationship between paid ministry and vocational ministry. 

It’s the tail wagging the dog.  The wife does not play second fiddle to the husband.  Nor does marriage play second fiddle to vocational ministry.  Anything that suggests this has gotton things the wrong way around.

However, I will stand with Gordon, Fiona, and Warren in saying that if considering vocational ministry, a couple should be talking about it before marriage.  and each spouses gifts, abilities, character and opportunities should play a part in how they minister to each other and the world.

Let me further suggest that we need to stop thinking leaving vocational ministry is a bad thing - especially when the person is doing so out of care for their family.  We should celebrate and thank God when this happens, as it is right and good.  God first.  Marriage second.  Vocational ministry third.

When considering the ‘demands of ministry’, I have a suspicion that in some (maybe many) cases the ‘demands’ are actually the product of the minister’s ambition. So practically I fear the outworking of such advice might be ‘look for someone who shares your desire to acheive certain goals’. I can imagine the situation where a prospective spouse loves jesus, loves ministry, seeks to serve but just doesn’t want the whole world in the same way the other half does. Is this ‘halving’? No, just sensible.

Furthermore, what about the unforseen circumstances which come up post wedding cermony? If a value is placed on the amount of ministry done (which is exactly what the original comment alludes to), then an inappropriate bitterness soon sits at the kitchen table when family circumstances change, or when the spouse is not as ‘high capacity’ as first suspected. There is no way of knowing for sure how things will go beofre you are married (our christian values of chaste living ensure this) and the promise of faithfulness no matter what is the higher value, rather than the amount of ministry you can do.

Yes marriages have a task to serve God as they serve others as a family, but it’s an issue of directing the marriage in this direction rather than having some kind of quantitative goal.